There were probably over two thousand people at the townhall, but the first couple hundred were pretty much all supporters of the Obamacare bill- they all had the same signs with the same colors and same handwriting. Only the first 800 got in to talk to Peters, and that group was about 50/50 between supporters and oppenents of the Democratic healthcare reform proposals. The remaining 1000+ was about 4:1 against, and I was in that group, even though I showed up at 4:30 to talk to my Congressman for a 6:00 event.
As I understand it, the people inside could submit questions that Peters answer, and that the questions that he answers were balanced between those in favor of Obamacare and those opposed to it. Most of the people leaving told me that Peters gave the impression that this was a complicated issue best left to government experts to figure out. Those outside were left to just talk, mingle, and educate one another.
For this first post, I'm just going to put up some pictures and a video I shot from the event. I was there until the police told us to go home at about 8:30 pm.
First, here is the video that I shot from my camera phone. You can make out flags, posters, and lots of people there. This was shot after some people had been there for 3 hours already. The chanting is "kill the bill" and the background noise are the many discussions and arguments between supporters and opponents of national socialized medicine.
Later the crowd started to chant "Bring Peters Out"- many constituents there waited hours to talk to their own Congressman, but he snuck in and out of the townhall using back entrances and policy cover.
Here is a crowd shot- this is the group outside of the school, the people who didn't get in to talk to their Congressman:
Look at this group- is this an angry mob of hateful racist people, as some liberals liken these groups to be? No- this is America- waving flags, loving liberty and freedom, and opposing Obama's government takeover of healthcare.
I've got more pictures- I will update a little later showing you some of the for and against posters, and also record some of my thoughts and impressions, as I frequently engaged supporters of Obamacare in debate and discussion. Enjoy for now!
UPDATE I: As some of you might have picked up on from my earlier posts about going to protests, I enjoy talking to supporters of Obamacare. My hope is that through discussion and conversation, I can introduce doubt into their belief system and put that little bug of freedom and liberty in their brains and hearts. Some people who support Obama are too far gone to even try- one guy told me to go back to torturing innocent people and invading law-abiding countries- I assume that he was referring to the enhanced interrogation techniques of terrorists and the War on Iraq, but regardless, he is too far gone down the path for me to talk to.
One of the frequent arguments that liberals trotted out was that healthcare was a right. I've already blogged about my thoughts on this, and tried to bring them up to Obamacare supporters- that healthcare is not a right. Several told me that my ideas about rights were outdated and no longer correct- that rights come from government and are the same thing as entitlements. That they believe this makes me sad.
Another argument that was frequently advanced (and the good thing about liberals is that they are all working off of the same playbook and always fall back on the same talking points) was that people accept fire departments, and police, and schools, and libraries, so why not give the government the power over healthcare too? I responded by saying that those were given to local and state government, not national government, and they said that didn't matter, that the federal government now runs everything, as it should- they openly laughed at the principle of federalism. I asked where does it stop then- what do we not give to the government? The supporters of Obamacare said 'somewhere', but I got the feeling that they would be willing to give the government the power over every aspect of your life.
See, this is not a debate about healthcare- this is a debate about the very nature of government- when pressed, liberals fall back on their belief system in government control, and the details no longer matter any more.
UPDATE II: Here are some pictures of some of the posters of those who oppose Obamacare. Notice how almost all are homemade, and they each advance a different and unique argument against national socialized control of healthcare.
The poster in this picture says "Give me Liberty, Not Debt":
The poster in this picture says "Congress is the problem":
This gentleman's sign says "Question Boldly, Demand Answers"- always good advice when the government is trying to nationalized 1/4 of the economy- it's surprising that people were shouting at him and one guy in all black even gave him the finger:
UPDATE III: Anyone who was at this event noticed right away that it was heavily astroturfed by liberal Democrats supporting Obamacare. There were two varieties of posters that they carried. The first that I will show you a picture of was paid for by Health Care for America NOW! This interest group looks like a group that the President of the United States is actively supporting (at least its website claims this), and kind of looks like a Moveon.org/George-Sorus funded clone. Here is the sign they provided for this event- there were about 50 like this- it says "Standing Together for Health Insurance Reform":
The other major variety of sign that was found at this healthcare rally is seen below. There were over 30 of these signs that I counted, and they were all carried by a group standing near the front of the line to get in. They all were on the same posterboard material, the same handwriting in the same colors, and all parroting similar messages. I asked one of the people carrying the sign where he got it- he said he made it himself. I asked if he made all the rest- he said that each one was made my the individual carrying it. I didn't call him a liar then because I wanted to be polite, but I'll say it now- he was an astroturfing liar, as you can see by this picture. No signs were allowed in the townhall, and so here is the pile of them outside. The slogans on these signs say "Equal Care 4 All," "Rich Grannies for Healthcare Reform Now," "Hate Kills and Care Cures," "Republicans Lie," etc.:
Thanks to the Detroit News, I figured out who produced all of these signs. According to the article in the newspaper, these signs were produced by a lady named Karen MacKenzie. According to Open Secrets, she lives in Northville, which is not part of Peter's district. Tsk-tsk- the invite said 'constituents only', Ms. MacKenzie. Oh, I also notice that she is married to an activist judge in Oakland County who is chair of the local Sierra Club. This information was pulled off later versions of the Detroit News story.
Also, speaking about the MSM, they got it all wrong as always. The Detroit News says "about 200 who weren't allowed into the full auditorium milled around outside during the forum"- as you can see from the video and pictures, there was well over 200 people- I estimate that about 800 people didn't get in, and 3 hours after they didn't get in, there was still over 200 people outside. And they weren't 'milling around' any more than our patriot forefathers 'milled around' during their civic protests. Thank you MSM for slighting and miscounting all of those who showed up for this event but couldn't get in.
UPDATE IV: Welcome readers of Pundit & Pundette, Gateway Pundit, Right Michigan, Motor City Times, Vox Popoli, The Other Club, Critical Narrative, and The Blog Prof. This post is simply a journalism-style post- be sure to enjoy while you are here my other posts on education, the environment, and other political issues.
UPDATE V: Here is another picture of an Obamacare supporter. I've talked to this lady previously- see my post The People vs a Person for more on that encounter, but this time I simply took a picture of her with her sign. It reads "Dems Won, GOP Lost, Healthcare NOW." When I asked her what her sign meant, she said that once the Democrats won control of Congress and the President, it gave them the authority to pass any laws that they wanted, without regard to the Constitution or minority rights. I informed her that 'we won and now can do whatever we want to you' is the justification for dictators and bad guys- she said she didn't care, that's the logic she wanted to use. Understand this- the loudest liberal supporters of Obamacare on the front lines of this debate are not really even hiding their support for a fascist dictatorship. Are you hiding your opposition to it? Here is the sign:
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